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Jewish Anti-Goyism and the Entrenched Divisions in the Palestine Movement
September 4, 2015 6:57 pm
Sorry, Taxi. Of course every situation is always more complicated than it seems. Everything, though, boils down to a few basics that do or don't check with one's principles. The worn plea of "it looks wrong but it's so very much more complicated than you think" doesn't sound any different than when used by the usual Zionist. I hoped to further discuss here how we could end any formal collaboration with JVP and Co. (and rid the solidarity movement from tribal Zionist sympathizers working to keep the 2-state negotiation open as the next excuse for continuing genocide) but I like working on a single issue at a time when together with people, that's why I certainly will avoid intervening here. As for the charge of being impolite or offensive, it may well be true but I don't see where.
September 4, 2015 8:49 am
Taxi, all I see in Egypt is an old, Zionist-led, US-sponsored murderous military dictatorship, rewarmed with a putsch against a duly elected government and untold barbary against the people, period (in stenographic terms an Egyptian model revamped and recycled in ex-Turkish garb.) All the "geopolitics" talk doesn't cancel that; additional considerations and personal preferences etc. do not change the few basic elements. Perhaps I am especially sensitive, having lived under a military dictatorship for a longish time. Yes, I'm aware of the major surprise on MW at your defending something so crass. Anyway, this is your site and you have just indicated you didn't want it discussed. There was no need to flare up though, as not only did the discussion not come up unprovoked, it was not even a discussion of your position re Egypt but only a warning that defending simultaneously divergent positions may alienate a good number of the people you need or want to work with (i.e. the antizionists.) I am not discussing it with you again ever, because that's distracting from Palestine. That's all.
September 3, 2015 3:04 pm
The way you go about it you may lose a lot of people, too. Defending this or that faction in matters not directly related to Palestine, (or defending obvious enemies of Palestinian resistance), like you do for Egypt, is incredibly divisive. If you can stick to Palestine and Palestinian resistance as only our common interest it may become more productive. And yes, obviously this is not just Max B but a whole, well-oiled machine of tribal/fake nationalist control both within and outside Zionism. We have to focus on that, not get at each other's throats when the problems are already huge. It's you site of course; if you want to blow steam defending, say, the Zionist-US-controlled fascists of Cairo or something else, enjoy. At a price.
September 3, 2015 9:30 pm
I think you didn't read. Of course Max is a tribalist asshole even though he writes very well, there's no discussion there. This only had to do with injecting one's own take on completely different situations, forcing each other to start bitching about extraneous things like military dictatorships.
September 3, 2015 3:22 pm
Do we really need a group of people that proudly identifies itself as practicing tribal identity politics and gladly includes Zionists to dominate a life-or-death fight against Zionism? The absurdity of it! If anyone who follows the Jewish religion or has some illusion of a non-religious "identity" wants to help, why don't they do it just as human beings --the focus is liberating Palestine, not wasting time with some 2.5% marginal tribe. We don't need JVP. Or Max.
September 3, 2015 5:09 pm
Well then, stick to your fascists. No friends of the Palestinian resistance, major allies of Zionism and slaves of the US. My point was that you cannot run multiple issues without losing you alliances. Especially if your position on one is diametrally opposed to the other.
Who and What the Heck is Plato's Guns?!
August 30, 2015 5:37 pm
No, just what the plain words mean: only interested politically.
August 30, 2015 5:22 pm
A very good idea. A judeocentric take on Palestine is almost the dominant style (sometimes looking like the only available style) on the Web and the US street --even some sites run by non-Jewish Arabs. It may do some good in places but too close to fraternization with the enemy or even invasion advocacy. Just bear in mind that some of us are one-track minds with no cultural ties to Palestine.
What now, Einstein?
August 19, 2015 9:17 pm
northcascadian, Any non-religious (or even non-jewishly-religious) person with the appropriate heredity may be an ex-Jew, or recovering Jew. In most cases, though, that person will simply be a never-was-Jew. There is nothing there aside from religion and a fake, recently invented rabid racial/tribal nationalism that often goes together with a totally secular philosophy. There's nothing to blow the whistle over, either. People who have never been inside cannot be insiders. Where it becomes hairy is with non-religious people who call themselves "Jewish" because of some biological connection. As far as they consider themselves still Jewish because of a "blood" bond, they prove that they are nationalists, even if they do not adhere to Zionism. That's too close a relationship for comfort (i.e. Phil Weiss, for example, or Max Blumenthal, calling Zionists "my people".)
Activist, Heal Thyself
August 20, 2015 7:53 pm
What I particularly like is the stupidity exposed and underlined by her cutesy-poo attempts at sounding intelligent. As in: "Universal antiracism includes opposing antisemitism" just after having attacked posts that isolate "antisemitism" as racism, i.e. directed at a group of people who happen to be born as nominally "Jewish", clearly distinguishable from criticism of any later-acquired things (religion, politics, etc.), by raising another ruckus. She was (and some others were, too) saying that criticism of acquired traits, while not racism, were "as bad" and fully part of a not better defined "antisemitism".
August 19, 2015 6:29 am
C&D, I would say that Phil Weiss' motivation is not exactly the same as that of the JVP leadership. The former seems to be trying to "save" the good name if the tribe, while the latter look as if their priority were to save the Zionist entity in Palestine. For the JVP it's easy to infer it from their change of "occupied territories" to "territories occupied in 1967" and the correspondingly limited (Beinart-style) boycott goals. Phil Weiss seems to be steadily evolving. Slowly.
Mondoweiss Breaks Silence Over The Alison Weir/JVP Controversy – Or Does It?
August 13, 2015 2:18 pm
I'm one of those who "resent her America-firster attitude" for a reason diametrally opposed to that of the JVP (and much of the MW) people. I suspect the same can be said for Keith, even though I don't know him at all: we are just intolerant of nationalism in any shape or wise, even though in any situation dealt us by life we have to work with, and for, the nationalists among the oppressed people. In the case of Palestine, all decisions having to be taken by the Palestinians means working with a lot of understandably nationalist people --including some of our nationalists like, say, Buchanan or Raimundo, in mutual respect. The reason the JVP crowd is so destructive is different: JVP only exists because of those guys' own ultra-nationalism. They see "Jewish" as a nation of some kind, not just a religion --most aren't religious at all anyway. Their only difference from the Zionists is in questioning the invasion of someone else's land. But they still belong to the tribe and consider Zionists their family. In fact, as you'll see in Susan Landau's self-description they don't call themselves anti-Zionist but "non-Zionist", whatever that's supposed to mean (neutral?) What unleashes their Bible-style relentless wrath against Alison Weir and Gilad Atzmon is the fact that these do not recognize the absurd claim of Jews, I suppose defined as "born to a Jewish woman", being a "nation" --Atzmon, of impeccable biologic-Jewish origin and Israeli-born, being also demonized as "antisemitic". It's the same reason that made them start their own exclusive club to participate in the solidarity movement, with no clear borders between them and the Zionist enemy: all they care about is the good name of a phantom "nation" or a tribe. Not Palestine getting rid of its invaders. Especially not getting rid of its invaders. We've had 70 years of a relentless shooting war while the Hebrew nationalists are still trying to keep intact their family ties to the Zionists.
August 13, 2015 5:05 pm
C&D, Pepsi, McBride, Taxi et al: I don't want to start a discussion on nationalism in general, or different "ethnic" understandings, or the wide world. Our object is Palestinian resistance and getting rid of the Zionist invader, no more: my further politics and yours are only relevant insofar as regards the fight against Zionists. So I'll go on believing that patriotism and nationalism is the same shit anytime anywhere, that Zionism is a twin nationalist brother of Nazism and that one can very well and effectively work and fight, shoulder-to-shoulder as it is, with nationalists --as long as it is in the service of an oppressed nation. To adapt from otehr well-known discussions, "some nationalists are my best friends". The only solid fact is that we have been at war, not a make-believe one where one can keep Zionist family, for 70 years: it would be suicidal to let JVP command or monopolize the podium.
August 13, 2015 7:30 pm
Pepsi, As already said, if we are getting together here it's for the purpose of trying to offer some help to the Palestinian resistance, not convert each other to our own worldview. Whether DC needs to be liberated from Zionist occupation or occupied by the Red Army or taken over by Martians, we can always agree on what we want to achieve before we get to the point where disemboweling each other may become the order of the day. The time seems ripe, at any rate, for a separation from the quasi-or-liberal-Zionists intent on controlling resistance against Zionism.
Mondoweiss: Bird In A Cage
August 25, 2015 2:52 am
Walid: " Without them, we’d have little to say to each other." If that were true, the web site would be redundant. We sure don't need one more Mondoweiss.
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